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TERA PC - General Discussion: Board a thing to talk about. (Rant)
Okay where shall we start this is going be a very interesting topic and something that I don't see people talk about in world chat as much as it should be very common problems, but I'll start with the main one thing is in all the hard mode five-star dungeons for the last few patches have been too hard for the scaled difficulty level for people in North America. It should be adjusted for each region, even removing mechanics completely for some regions. An example of this is the Simon says mechanics in recent patches. People with a short-term memory, difficulty will have issues with this mechanic, which are many gamers we have very well. I shouldn't say everyone most people don't have a great short-term memory to think of something. 40 seconds in the future. For those who comment below go on any server that plays at a casually (at a hardcore level) and tell me you ever see a LFG for five-star dungeon main reason is people can't do it. It's not like they don't want to. It's just things that require the short-term memory mechanic causes people to just say you not screw it, I won't do this content. I'll wait until the next patch when things are fixed, but they never get fixed. No matter how many times people complain and stress out about it. Keep in mind if it requires discord to teach, then it's too bloody hard for Tera. If you need someone to alert you in voice chat, then they should be avoided. That mechanic at so I think anyways. Thanks for reading my boredom rant comments below let's get a discussion going.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but what I get from this is that you believe 5⭐ dungeons should be scaled down to accommodate for casual players. The whole point of these dungeons is to provide more challenging content to players who want to be challenged. Casual players have 1⭐ to 4⭐ dungeons if they want to run low and moderate difficulty content. Leave the higher skill players and their dungeons alone.
Equitas wrote: »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but what I get from this is that you believe 5⭐ dungeons should be scaled down to accommodate for casual players. The whole point of these dungeons is to provide more challenging content to players who want to be challenged. Casual players have 1⭐ to 4⭐ dungeons if they want to run low and moderate difficulty content. Leave the higher skill players and their dungeons alone.

More like make it possible for lfgs to exists after two months after the patch on nonpopulated servers. Sort of on the lines of these types of dungeons SSHM (After iframe fixes) TSHM, FIHM and RMHM was the limit before lfgs couldn't take place. The last two patches I virtually see no LFGs due to the severity of the dungeon. All I'm saying is adjusted for North American audiences. No Simon says how about avoid these AOE's mechanics. Three back to back that would be a good replacement.

Dungeon seemed to be avoided like the plague with any type of non-straightforward mechanics. You can even turn any mechanic into non-straightforward one. Just by adding a stupid secondary effect. That's what kills hardmode dungeons for most people. Keep in mind I listed "Hardcore" skill set. Besides casual play nature, meaning a person has three hours a day to play a game, but they're extremely good at the game when you think casual you think a noob.

Handy little scale for any future references. I make.

Leach / Noob / New / Novice / Normal / Avg / Hardcore / Pro / Elite / Meta

I think a hardcore player should be able to do 5star dungeon and clear it.
Equitas wrote: »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but what I get from this is that you believe 5⭐ dungeons should be scaled down to accommodate for casual players. The whole point of these dungeons is to provide more challenging content to players who want to be challenged. Casual players have 1⭐ to 4⭐ dungeons if they want to run low and moderate difficulty content. Leave the higher skill players and their dungeons alone.

One other thing I have a felling your on a pvp sever... Most likely MT xD. The lfg doesn't effect you or your apart of a core static that can do it. Meaning friends / Group of people you run with constantly. how you just commented seems to be like that.
If you want easier content then there is plenty of that in the game already. No need to nerf the "hardest content in the game" to be even easier than it already is.
Correct me if I'm wrong/outdated on this but:

Isn't it purely bragging rights and challenge that people do 5 star dungeons for? The rewarding is crap enough to be more worth running RG than those, it's a huge time loss for no more than the bragging rights of saying "I cleared it!" or "I got skilled on it!".

If it's too hard for people to run it, they can always just run easier things. Specially since you literally are asking to simplify it to the point of making it a 4 star dungeon. There is a reason there's 5 star dungeons, and it's for the very few that want the ridiculous challenge. TERA-EU had extreme mode dungeons with literally nothing more than forced/fake difficulty added, like removing the HP bar on the boss, removing some AOE indicators, unnecessary amount of one shots and damage over time and so on. Didn't they do it again even? Still, how many you think plays extreme mode dungeons? It was never intended to be the most popular content. This here sounds to me like a topic on the old forums that said on the title even "I want the game to be easier" and proceeded on the comment to say he didn't even care about others wanting challenges, he just wants it easier so he could run all the content without too much effort, literally. Yours is a toned down version but basically.... the same. You wanna remove the most challenging/masocore content possible, when the intention of that content is exactly this, and to cater exactly to the few that need this.

Again, there's plenty of easier dungeons, in fact isn't the only 5 stars the exact same dungeons that already have normal modes?
The only thing I could actually want, would be like adding some Harrow Hold Easy Mode to train it out and be able to do the real deal when strong enough, not removing the harder/making THAT one easier.
ElinLove wrote: »
Correct me if I'm wrong/outdated on this but:

Isn't it purely bragging rights and challenge that people do 5 star dungeons for? The rewarding is crap enough to be more worth running RG than those, it's a huge time loss for no more than the bragging rights of saying "I cleared it!" or "I got skilled on it!".

If it's too hard for people to run it, they can always just run easier things. Specially since you literally are asking to simplify it to the point of making it a 4 star dungeon. There is a reason there's 5 star dungeons, and it's for the very few that want the ridiculous challenge. TERA-EU had extreme mode dungeons with literally nothing more than forced/fake difficulty added, like removing the HP bar on the boss, removing some AOE indicators, unnecessary amount of one shots and damage over time and so on. Didn't they do it again even? Still, how many you think plays extreme mode dungeons? It was never intended to be the most popular content. This here sounds to me like a topic on the old forums that said on the title even "I want the game to be easier" and proceeded on the comment to say he didn't even care about others wanting challenges, he just wants it easier so he could run all the content without too much effort, literally. Yours is a toned down version but basically.... the same. You wanna remove the most challenging/masocore content possible, when the intention of that content is exactly this, and to cater exactly to the few that need this.

Again, there's plenty of easier dungeons, in fact isn't the only 5 stars the exact same dungeons that already have normal modes?
The only thing I could actually want, would be like adding some Harrow Hold Easy Mode to train it out and be able to do the real deal when strong enough, not removing the harder/making THAT one easier.

More like removing skeletons from phase 4, then nerfing the whole dungeon completely. Just stuff to cause a false difficulty. just make vergos 25% faster in its stead then less time to pick a color compensate for the change.
Then here lies the problem, when you have a Simon says mechanic this "Fix would be adding a way to see constantly what he is going to do next. In out Pulse.

Then you would need to remove the mechanic completely just a fix for our region. Sort of like how they're used to be "Tools that add alerts for dungeons. Which most people use by default. The people with ease...
They are called "hard mode" for a reason. If you're not willing to put the time and effort into learning them then you will never clear them. If you can't handle the difficulty level you can do normal mode. Why remove some mechanics from hard mode when you can just do normal mode since it doesn't have these mechanics that you want removed???
TERA PC - General Discussion#10 VGPlayer03/01/2018, 03:58 PM
9XNTHP5R3H wrote: »
They are called "hard mode" for a reason. If you're not willing to put the time and effort into learning them then you will never clear them. If you can't handle the difficulty level you can do normal mode. Why remove some mechanics from hard mode when you can just do normal mode since it doesn't have these mechanics that you want removed???

Hmm... In the comments I did express what I mean I want to happen, then again I should add it into the main post. I think hardcore players should be able to clear it with 100+ hrs of training in it. Don't you agree? If there is a problem from stopping most people from doing a dungeon they should fix it"" Make it fun.
TERA PC - General Discussion#11 Laemie03/01/2018, 04:01 PM
But... the mechanic is all it has...? I mean, its supposed to make the fight more intense, imagine its all easy and the dungeon literally tells you what attack its going to do then... its nothing but a normal attack and the boss will become a punching bag, even more boring because his attacks are super slow and youre not supposed to get hit at all, the only time you die is because you clip through the boss. Not to mention the healer usually calls out the attack (In chat), then all you have to do is to read the texts and follow lol, like its not straight forward enough...

The mechanic in RMh wasnt even "unfair" as you mentioned at all, i think it was only unfair for 200 ping Priest because they had to stop and cleanse, which other classes dont have to do if they pay their attention to the game and walk? But then i even saw my co-GM did some godlike cleanse into backstep moves and we all had a very good laugh at it, her ping is always at 240-250. My ping is 250-300 and i really never had any issue with that stagger laser, if i died, i died because there was no cleanse really. If we want to discuss about unfair mechanic, we should talk about the RMh first boss mechanic which was pretty "unfair" for highping players because they literally died while being in the safezone but even that had a work around if you did some simple math and if i was healing, i always called out if the AOE was coming soon for my teammates because i knew it helped.

Back to the RKe topic, i am by no mean a hardcore player, i afk 24/7, i mostly do Ghillieglade and occasional easy dungeons (429, 431) with my babies Guildies, lately i have been having a daily-ish RKe group, we do it daily-ish, but it took us quite awhile to clear and we barely clear it daily til this day. In my opinion, the reason ppl jump in RKe is the intense play, the pressure to remember attacks and slaying, if it changes so they can do it with "ease", with no pressure then whats the reason to do it then?
Laemie wrote: »
But... the mechanic is all it has...? I mean, its supposed to make the fight more intense, imagine its all easy and the dungeon literally tells you what attack its going to do then... its nothing but a normal attack and the boss will become a punching bag, even more boring because his attacks are super slow and youre not supposed to get hit at all, the only time you die is because you clip through the boss. Not to mention the healer usually calls out the attack (In chat), then all you have to do is to read the texts and follow lol, like its not straight forward enough...

The mechanic in RMh wasnt even "unfair" as you mentioned at all, i think it was only unfair for 200 ping Priest because they had to stop and cleanse, which other classes dont have to do if they pay their attention to the game and walk? But then i even saw my co-GM did some godlike cleanse into backstep moves and we all had a very good laugh at it, her ping is always at 240-250. My ping is 250-300 and i really never had any issue with that stagger laser, if i died, i died because there was no cleanse really. If we want to discuss about unfair mechanic, we should talk about the RMh first boss mechanic which was pretty "unfair" for highping players because they literally died while being in the safezone but even that had a work around if you did some simple math and if i was healing, i always called out if the AOE was coming soon for my teammates because i knew it helped.

Back to the RKe topic, i am by no mean a hardcore player, i afk 24/7, i mostly do Ghillieglade and occasional easy dungeons (429, 431) with my babies Guildies, lately i have been having a daily-ish RKe group, we do it daily-ish, but it took us quite awhile to clear and we barely clear it daily til this day. In my opinion, the reason ppl jump in RKe is the intense play, the pressure to remember attacks and slaying, if it changes so they can do it with "ease", with no pressure then whats the reason to do it then?

On a Low populated sever"" we don't have these "groups nor we do in such small numbers its unreasonable. People need to know how to do the dungeon in order to do "RKEM" right? Please keep in mind If you talk in this topic please confirm you aren't cheating"" aka tools to enhance your exp.

its just I have a felling most people that saying these type of topics are using these types of alerts or enhancements. Sorry for being judgemental just I want to express it how it is. just way to many people I know use these tools and say its too easy then with them off they go MEH I don't care what you say. in there mind its like (This proofs nothing).
TERA PC - General Discussion#13 Laemie03/01/2018, 04:08 PM
Oh low polulated server hmm... Does CH Count? Because im in CH. You know, i had a few months to train ppl to do RKn, then to RKh, then finally RKe, my RK-HM LFG with my co-GM lf'd for 1 DPS always took HOURS upon HOURS, we sometimes even gave up and took it off but i am very glad we managed and the ppl we have they made progress, because i saw the effort, and i saw how it got paid off. Maybe you should start trainin ppl then? If you play 3 hours a day you can look for ppl for 2 hours and play an hour. Our RK-HM never happened until weekend. Thats why it took us really long to be exp'd.
TERA PC - General Discussion#14 ElinLove03/01/2018, 04:09 PM
VGPlayer wrote: »
Laemie wrote: »
But... the mechanic is all it has...? I mean, its supposed to make the fight more intense, imagine its all easy and the dungeon literally tells you what attack its going to do then... its nothing but a normal attack and the boss will become a punching bag, even more boring because his attacks are super slow and youre not supposed to get hit at all, the only time you die is because you clip through the boss. Not to mention the healer usually calls out the attack (In chat), then all you have to do is to read the texts and follow lol, like its not straight forward enough...

The mechanic in RMh wasnt even "unfair" as you mentioned at all, i think it was only unfair for 200 ping Priest because they had to stop and cleanse, which other classes dont have to do if they pay their attention to the game and walk? But then i even saw my co-GM did some godlike cleanse into backstep moves and we all had a very good laugh at it, her ping is always at 240-250. My ping is 250-300 and i really never had any issue with that stagger laser, if i died, i died because there was no cleanse really. If we want to discuss about unfair mechanic, we should talk about the RMh first boss mechanic which was pretty "unfair" for highping players because they literally died while being in the safezone but even that had a work around if you did some simple math and if i was healing, i always called out if the AOE was coming soon for my teammates because i knew it helped.

Back to the RKe topic, i am by no mean a hardcore player, i afk 24/7, i mostly do Ghillieglade and occasional easy dungeons (429, 431) with my babies Guildies, lately i have been having a daily-ish RKe group, we do it daily-ish, but it took us quite awhile to clear and we barely clear it daily til this day. In my opinion, the reason ppl jump in RKe is the intense play, the pressure to remember attacks and slaying, if it changes so they can do it with "ease", with no pressure then whats the reason to do it then?

On a Low populated sever"" we don't have these "groups nor we do in such small numbers its unreasonable. People need to know how to do the dungeon in order to do "RKEM" right? Please keep in mind If you talk in this topic please confirm you aren't cheating"" aka tools to enhance your exp.

its just I have a felling most people that saying these type of topics are using these types of alerts or enhancements. Sorry for being judgemental just I want to express it how it is. just way to many people I know use these tools and say its too easy then with them off they go MEH I don't care what you say. in there mind its like (This proofs nothing).

Congrats on making the thread locked in the next few hours!
TERA PC - General Discussion#15 VGPlayer03/01/2018, 04:10 PM
ElinLove wrote: »
VGPlayer wrote: »
Laemie wrote: »
But... the mechanic is all it has...? I mean, its supposed to make the fight more intense, imagine its all easy and the dungeon literally tells you what attack its going to do then... its nothing but a normal attack and the boss will become a punching bag, even more boring because his attacks are super slow and youre not supposed to get hit at all, the only time you die is because you clip through the boss. Not to mention the healer usually calls out the attack (In chat), then all you have to do is to read the texts and follow lol, like its not straight forward enough...

The mechanic in RMh wasnt even "unfair" as you mentioned at all, i think it was only unfair for 200 ping Priest because they had to stop and cleanse, which other classes dont have to do if they pay their attention to the game and walk? But then i even saw my co-GM did some godlike cleanse into backstep moves and we all had a very good laugh at it, her ping is always at 240-250. My ping is 250-300 and i really never had any issue with that stagger laser, if i died, i died because there was no cleanse really. If we want to discuss about unfair mechanic, we should talk about the RMh first boss mechanic which was pretty "unfair" for highping players because they literally died while being in the safezone but even that had a work around if you did some simple math and if i was healing, i always called out if the AOE was coming soon for my teammates because i knew it helped.

Back to the RKe topic, i am by no mean a hardcore player, i afk 24/7, i mostly do Ghillieglade and occasional easy dungeons (429, 431) with my babies Guildies, lately i have been having a daily-ish RKe group, we do it daily-ish, but it took us quite awhile to clear and we barely clear it daily til this day. In my opinion, the reason ppl jump in RKe is the intense play, the pressure to remember attacks and slaying, if it changes so they can do it with "ease", with no pressure then whats the reason to do it then?

On a Low populated sever"" we don't have these "groups nor we do in such small numbers its unreasonable. People need to know how to do the dungeon in order to do "RKEM" right? Please keep in mind If you talk in this topic please confirm you aren't cheating"" aka tools to enhance your exp.

its just I have a felling most people that saying these type of topics are using these types of alerts or enhancements. Sorry for being judgemental just I want to express it how it is. just way to many people I know use these tools and say its too easy then with them off they go MEH I don't care what you say. in there mind its like (This proofs nothing).

Congrats on making the thread locked in the next few hours!

Why?
I didn't do anything bad. o.o I'm just tired of people saying same thing over and over again.

Also this is a rant as well. so its just existing to get out something out of my mind. Made these types of forms before rant forms and list "Enhancements as well in them and didn't get locked."
BHS said they don't want to rely on those types of mechs anymore themselves. I don't remember when, or where, but they said they'll focus on quick reaction types of mechs more instead of memorization mechs. Sadly I don't have the source but if I find it somewhere I'll link it here.

While I get what you mean (taking away mechs and replacing them with something else) I believe that those complicated mechs are not the reason why such a low number of people are doing those dungeons. I don't think removing those mechs would necessarily bring people back.
Instead, here are a few more likely reasons of why rke isn't that popular:
a) Dungeons aren't rewarding, time to gold ratio is not well adjusted.
b) Dungeons are unbalanced. They're adjusted for ktera and their talents, hence we have to slay in rke to clear it normally - too much of a bother for most people and refer to a). This also makes it hard to do RKE with LFG because you depend on other people's dps too hard and it's too risky. A lot of RKE's are being done inside guilds among people that trust each other.
c) Population is declining. Pretty obvious. Less people to make LFG's, less people to do dungeons with.
d) Subjective opinions. This is just subjective and based off my experience, but it's also connected to your thread I guess. People have the most mixed opinions about RKH/E, mostly leaning towards the negative. A lot of people I know that used to do high end content before dislike this dungeon.
e) Net issues, coding issues, call it what you will. Having to restart fights due to someone desyncing through RK9's legs while slaying and getting hit and dying to his basic just makes it a pain in the [filtered]. Double s-bomb is way too fast for some people etc..
TERA PC - General Discussion#17 VGPlayer03/01/2018, 04:35 PM
CornishRex wrote: »
BHS said they don't want to rely on those types of mechs anymore themselves. I don't remember when, or where, but they said they'll focus on quick reaction types of mechs more instead of memorization mechs. Sadly I don't have the source but if I find it somewhere I'll link it here.

While I get what you mean (taking away mechs and replacing them with something else) I believe that those complicated mechs are not the reason why such a low number of people are doing those dungeons. I don't think removing those mechs would necessarily bring people back.
Instead, here are a few more likely reasons of why rke isn't that popular:
a) Dungeons aren't rewarding, time to gold ratio is not well adjusted.
b) Dungeons are unbalanced. They're adjusted for ktera and their talents, hence we have to slay in rke to clear it normally - too much of a bother for most people and refer to a). This also makes it hard to do RKE with LFG because you depend on other people's dps too hard and it's too risky. A lot of RKE's are being done inside guilds among people that trust each other.
c) Population is declining. Pretty obvious. Less people to make LFG's, less people to do dungeons with.
d) Subjective opinions. This is just subjective and based off my experience, but it's also connected to your thread I guess. People have the most mixed opinions about RKH/E, mostly leaning towards the negative. A lot of people I know that used to do high end content before dislike this dungeon.
e) Net issues, coding issues, call it what you will. Having to restart fights due to someone desyncing through RK9's legs while slaying and getting hit and dying to his basic just makes it a pain in the [filtered]. Double s-bomb is way too fast for some people etc..

I think I made a topic about this like 2months ago. even gave some examples of proper scaling. Also how to fix the elite boost gold extra 35%g per run if active elite should be a thing. 2 star should give 450g 3 star 700 4 star 1.1k 5 star 2.4k
TERA PC - General Discussion#18 ElinLove03/01/2018, 04:45 PM
CornishRex wrote: »
BHS said they don't want to rely on those types of mechs anymore themselves. I don't remember when, or where, but they said they'll focus on quick reaction types of mechs more instead of memorization mechs. Sadly I don't have the source but if I find it somewhere I'll link it here.
[...]

R.I.P. high ping players. As always, K-TERA only balancing.

To be fair I would love to see some logic based mechanics. Memory games aren't all that much interesting I agree, but twich reflex mechanics are utter cancer. Something like TRNM's rings was very cool in my opinion at least, required quite the team work and not much more than knowing how to rotate it, could even spice it up a bit and add some puzzles there.
TERA PC - General Discussion#19 GardoVdl03/01/2018, 04:46 PM
ITT brainlets complain about the most difficult dungeon on the game
TERA PC - General Discussion#20 VGPlayer03/01/2018, 04:51 PM
Part of me just wants them to bring back old dungeons that were 5 star and just reduce the reward to match it. So people till have something to do that isn't so "Easy" but its content people can run in a lfg. that's harder then 4 star. Emphasis on no new cheap mechanics like they did with bp.

Take a tele porter that only 2 can fit so hopefully rng is on your side if you try take another portal 3 if your lucky. there's a delay of like 0.5 sec per person. would be fine if applied to everyone and there wasn't a limit per person but small "Tricks like this to make it simulate hard. isn't fun"
ElinLove wrote: »
CornishRex wrote: »
BHS said they don't want to rely on those types of mechs anymore themselves. I don't remember when, or where, but they said they'll focus on quick reaction types of mechs more instead of memorization mechs. Sadly I don't have the source but if I find it somewhere I'll link it here.
[...]

R.I.P. high ping players. As always, K-TERA only balancing.

To be fair I would love to see some logic based mechanics. Memory games aren't all that much interesting I agree, but twich reflex mechanics are utter cancer. Something like TRNM's rings was very cool in my opinion at least, required quite the team work and not much more than knowing how to rotate it, could even spice it up a bit and add some puzzles there.

I like manglemire, demon's wheel and broken prison mechs honestly (except for the second boss in bp, even though I got used to calling it and doing math FAST). Sadly those dungeons are very hard to do with randoms because sometimes it seems tera players are missing half a brain or something. Got stuck in mm for 3 hours once. Broken prison mechs are the most doable out of the 3 because you can cheese the first and second boss. Dungeons that require a lot of teamwork are fun af but you need people that understand english lol.
Get a static to clear the harder content.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Dont expect to clear 5 star dungeons with lfg's composed of people taking bong hits between bosses while still learning the dgn.
Dont nerf hard content so its no longer "hard" but is labeled 5 stars so people get the warm and fuzzy.
Day one BP people could not figure out the first boss mech took 4 hours for my first clear 15+ recruitment phases starting from an LFG. 60+ clears later mostly from IM's and honestly most of those runs were carries.
Nobody makes LFG's for certain dungeons for a reason. All it takes is one time in a HH LFG to get a feel what the learning speed/give a $*** of most people caps out at. This dosent mean that HH should be nerfed so that 20 random players watching stargate or anime or eating clear it in 2 hours their first go at it.

The problem lies in the fact that there are too few people willing to invest the time required to do well, sure you only play 3 hours a day but your pretty good at the game but for every one player like that theres 30 who spend 3 hours typing /sit /dance and lilliths keep is a challenge.

When i open LFG's i know by looking at the names IF and how fast a dgn will clear. Not a whole lot of names id trust in a HH or RMHM or RK9HM.
TERA PC - General Discussion#23 Lapomko03/01/2018, 11:34 PM
The other problem is also what DPS meter has brought to Tera right now. Everyone looks up on each other dps parses on a particular site and if you are bad wheel chair guy or only pull out subpar dps. No one will asks you to run end game content. Everyone can be easily be found through the rankings page.

The only way to do hard content is to get good and be a consistent player. I just have to login few minutes and already few guys asks me to run RKEM with them because they have a guy missing. And if you don't have clear in it just get good in RKNM. People will know it. We brought one guy that never cleared RKEM and he did well. Just because he has a reputation of being a good player.
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